[ausev] The real original vehicle, was Phoenix debut event

[Chris Robison]

Aaron, you make a very good point here. I am wrong to be calling this a
conversion. I would not call a Ford electric Ranger or a Chevy electric
S-10 a conversion. I certainly wouldn't call a Honda EV Plus a conversion
(I thought it was a ground-up design...?).

More to the point, I wouldn't call the Henney a conversion either, nor the
Jet Electrica nor the Solectria Force or E10. The Phoenix SUT fits
directly in the same category as these, and I should treat them similarly.

However, I think the difference is mostly a logistical and financial one
-- these companies have managed to buy cars without spending the extra
money on engines and related components, and have skipped the work of
pulling the unnecessary parts and disposing of them. Beyond that, the work
involved is the same as what would be encountered by a "conversion
company" focusing on specific automobiles. Design the parts around the
existing shape of the car, and find ways to make the construction process
more efficient and cost effective.

I think our jargon lacks terms that fully express how similar the two
ventures are.

  --chris



On Sat, March 10, 2007 6:49 am, Aaron Choate wrote:
> If what you are saying is that this is not a ground up electric vehicle
> design.  I agree with you.  However, I don't think I would call it a
> conversion.
>
> These vehicles are probably not going to be delivered as gas powered
> vehicles and then have their guts removed to then receive an electric
> drive train.  I expect that they will be delivered as gliders and then
> produced with an electric drive as their original method of getting
> around.
>
> Were the factory produced Ranger, S-10, Rav-4 and Honda EV+s conversions?
>
>
> No.  They may have been based on their gas powered brothers and sisters;
> they used the same designs, frames, bodies and other parts, but they were
> PRODUCED in quantity as electric vehicles and they never saw the light of
> a gasoline powered day.  They were the electric versions of a production
> vehicle.  Even the Tesla Roadster isn't entirely a ground up design.
> These
> companies are concentrating on the important part of producing electric...
>  getting the electric car on the road.
>
> What we saw at the unveiling was the running prototype.  I expect that
> the ones that they deliver to buyers will look and feel more like a
> factory produced vehicle.
>
> Anyway, its just my opinion, but I think what we (and conversion
> companies) are doing in our garages are conversions.  What companies like
> Phoenix (and
> the Henney Coach Company and Jet Electric before them) are doing are
> taking delivery of unfinished gliders and working out how to produce
> electric vehicles in quantity on an assembly line.
>
> Cya,
>
>
> Aaron Choate
>
>
>
> On 3/9/07, Chris Robison <eeyore at phototropia.org> wrote:
>
>>
>> Ah ha -- it's not the Musso exactly, but rather the models which will
>> replace them in their market:
>>
>> The SsangYong Actyon (SUV)
>> http://www.smotor.com/en/showroom/actyon/main.jsp
>>
>>
>> and the Actyon Sports (SUT) http://www.ssangyong.co.nz/actyonsports.html
>>
>>
>> So, I guess I don't really know what the hell their "designer" did.
>> This
>> looks like a straight up conversion, just with parts that us little
>> people can't afford.  :-)
>>
>> --chris
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, March 9, 2007 5:27 pm, Christopher Robison wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 2007-03-09 at 09:06 -0600, Mark Farver wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Interestingly a similar vehicle was shown at the 2005 Vancouver
>>>> EDTA
>>>> conference by "Boschert Engineering"
>>>>
>>>> http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=940
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> And, notice where else we see the Boschart Engineering name -- on a
>>> sticker on the Phoenix SUT as it was being demonstrated to President
>> Bush:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> http://tinyurl.com/yr3rxu
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Curious...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --chris
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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