[ausev] OT: Electric energy transfer and storage limitations

[John Rumsey]

If I had the money, the machine shop and the skills to
do it I would, despite my severe arthritis. I'd like
to be able to pay someone to build it. I am unable to
go the one way you suggest. I am hoping to contact
someone who will take the idea, say he can do that and
go ahead and build one, while I cheer from the
sidelines. There are lots of steam buffs building
steam engines, but they turn up their noses at the
hybrid idea. From everything I have read, using steam
is more efficient and less complex, easier to build.


--- Christopher Robison <eeyore at phototropia.org>
wrote:

> On Thu, 2007-05-17 at 04:12 +0100, John Rumsey
> wrote:
> > Then please point me in the right direction.
> Everyone
> > I have contacted has their own narrow agenda,
> > downright purists on that. I am suggesting a
> variation
> > on the plug-in EV by using a portable
> steam-powered
> > generator on some versions to overcome the
> drawbacks
> > of pure EV, just as hybridizing a steam engine
> with
> > electric power can overcome the drawbacks of pure
> > steam. The steam buffs think pure steam power is
> > perfect, the EV buffs think pure electric is
> perfect
> > and the IC crowd won't listen at all to anyone
> else.
> > There is a niche for EV, but to replace IC cars
> why
> > not combine technologies. I intend to keep trying
> to
> > promote the idea, if not allowed here then please
> tell
> > me where to find these other forums. Thank you.
> 
> What you're referring to is a plug-in hybrid, a
> concept I think most EV
> folks embrace. The steam engine instead of an ICE is
> an interesting
> idea, but I don't think you'll find many folks who
> are interested in the
> combination here.
> 
> We promote EVs for being efficient, and for being
> simple. We can build
> them ourselves, we can fully understand how they
> work, and we can repair
> them when they break. We have a prime mover with one
> moving part, we
> have just 4 basic components that compose the whole
> (batteries, motor,
> controller, charger) and this simplicity is
> compelling for a lot of the
> people I speak to on the subject.
> 
> Like today's hybrid vehicles, plug-in hybrids are
> *not* simple. You have
> the complexity of both systems, plus the system that
> allows them to
> interact. Whether it's a series hybrid (engine
> driving generator) or a
> parallel hybrid (motor assisting engine with
> mechanical propulsion),
> these systems are not something most of us want to
> build. We consider
> plug-in hybrids worth it however, because they can
> indeed be driven
> without consuming gasoline, for a limited distance.
> Still, I don't think
> any one of us would want to actually build one.
> 
> However, an ICE/electric plug-in hybrid is currently
> a possibility, as
> the hard work has been done by those producing kits
> to retrofit a Prius
> and hopefully soon other hybrids as well. This is
> accessible to us.
> Building a steam-powered hybrid may gain you a
> slight efficiency gain (I
> honestly do not know) but the additional fabrication
> and machining
> requirement is a lonely road not many would be
> willing to follow. A lot
> of people bristle when you mention picking up a MIG
> welder -- they just
> want to drive an environmentally friendly car.
> 
> If you insist on promoting this idea, I think
> there's only one way to
> go.
> 
> Build one, document what you've done, make it into a
> kit that is cheap
> enough to justify purchasing in replacement of the
> gas engine that we
> already have to start with when converting a car and
> in addition to the
> considerable expense of the electric powertrain
> we'll also need, and
> then start showing off your creation. In the
> process, get help and
> advice for the steam part from steam-power forums,
> and the electric part
> from us or other EV groups. For combining the two,
> there may be much
> that you will need to pioneer yourself.
> 
> I personally would love to see it, and if it were in
> this area I'd
> welcome a steam plug-in hybrid among the EVs we show
> at our PR events.
> 
>   --chris
> 
> 
> 
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