[ausev] Austin EV startup

Sat May 31 22:45:41 GMT 2008

one last word on hydrogen, Don't forget it must be compressed and kept sub  
zero cold to store it efficiently. 
. And if it escapes and starts to burn, that's called an explosion, Who  
wants this compressor plant in their back yard. The first explosion will kill  
many, and will  kill hydrogen as a public commodity. 
Chuck 

In a message dated 5/31/2008 5:38:05 P.M. Central Daylight Time,  
bytedawg at bytetamer.com writes:

Erik

On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 10:50 AM, m. edmund howse  <_bytedawg at bytetamer.com_ 
(mailto:bytedawg at bytetamer.com) > wrote:

Actually it isn't off topic because  hydrogen is a good source of electricity 
for the electric motor.
I'm  working on an electric motorcycle and auto at the moment myself. And.
A  lot of discussion here has been in regards to some form of generating 
power  to provide electricity to charge batteries etc. ICE are of course a good  
potential depending on the fuel. As far as I'm concerned the cleaner the  
better. But if hydrogen on demand works and some claim it does then you may  only 
need one battery in your electric vehicle instead of dozens and your  range 
will be unlimited. Kind of scary. But if you want to use batteries,  don't let me 
stop you. And of course if you don't want or can't believe it  can be done I 
won't argue with you either. But so far from my experience it  only takes 12 
watts of power to begin extracting hydrogen from plain old tap  water.
As far as I'm concerned whether hydrogen is used as a source of  electricity 
to power an electric motor or as a source of energy to power an  ICE that 
could do either should be of concern to  all.

marv

Ian Ward wrote:  

I think you misunderstand my point, Marv.  This  being the Austin ELECTRIC 
Vehicles mailing list, I'm not comparing it to  the efficiency of gasoline, I'm 
comparing it to a pure electric  drive.

Sure, with hydrogen drive (HCE or fool cell) you are  removing the millions 
of point sources of pollution and there is something  to be said for that, but 
when you compare the energy it takes to power a  hydrogen car vs an electric 
car, you're wasting a lot of energy - the  pollution of THAT is certainly an 
argument.

- ian

On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 9:26 AM, m. edmund howse  <_bytedawg at bytetamer.com_ 
(mailto:bytedawg at bytetamer.com) > wrote:

Efficiency???? How much energy do  you think it takes, Ian, to produce 
gasoline??? And how much pollution  does this process create???
As far as hydrogen is concerned, I have  built a hydrogen generator and I 
cannot understand why
anyone would  NOT consider this a feasible source of energy to power an  
automobile.
Hydrogen burns clean, really clean, producing only water.  And if you 
integrate this concept into the efficiency quotient in the  reduction of pollution, I 
think the efficiency concept is not even an  argument.

marv

Ian Ward wrote:  

I am more interested in their plug-in electrics, which  admittedly, don't 
seem to be the focus of their business. I was just  wondering if they've 
attempted to work or consult with anyone in the  vicinity.

I don't believe hydrogen is a viable energy storage  medium because "it's the 
efficiency, stupid."  Although, when you  are talking about super-performance 
cars, you get to hand-wave those  kinds of rational arguments at will.

- ian

On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 5:54 PM, Gil Dawson  <_Gil at gil.dawson.name_ 
(mailto:Gil at gil.dawson.name) > wrote:

At 4:30 P -0500 5/30/08, Ian Ward wrote:
Has anyone met/talked with these guys?  This is out of the  blue to me...

_http://www.bizjournals.com/austin/stories/2008/05/26/daily29.html_ 
(http://www.bizjournals.com/austin/stories/2008/05/26/daily29.html) 
_http://www.ronnmotors.com/_ (http://www.ronnmotors.com/) 

I haven't, but it's an interesting idea.  Hydrogen is  expensive, relative to 
gasoline (or, at least it was when they first  suggested fuel cell cars.)   
But you only consume it when  you want to go fast.   

Would you call this a hybrid?

If this idea sells then, if gas prices rise faster than  hydrogen prices 
(quite likely, IMHO), I can imagine that eventually  they could offer a series of 
aftermarket kits that would let the  owner use more and more hydrogen and 
require less and less  gas.

Ronn's taking a post-modernist approach to the  transition.

--Gil

P.S.  The article doesn't say, but these cars will burn  hydrogen in an 
internal combustion engine, right?  They're not  talking fuel cell here, are  they?

_______________________________________________
AusEV  mailing  list

**************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with 
Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.      
(http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002)
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://www.austinev.org/pipermail/ausev/attachments/20080531/3225bc96/attachment.htm 